Thursday 31 July 2008

A Doctor's More Objective View on the Value of the Pusrawi Hospital Medical Report of Saiful's Ass

From Malaysiakini's Letter to Editor: Read here


"Damn! SODOMY is now the most common word in this nation that pretends itself to be the paragon of Islamic awareness, as witnessed by the endless symposiums, seminars, talks, gatherings of so-called Islamic scholars with degrees and scrolls attesting to their Islamic achievements. But in reality, this country is fast turning into a cesspool of filth and moral degradation!"
- Zainol Abideen of "Mahaguru58" Blog

"... Having worked in the emergency departments of a few hospitals, I fully AGREE that the doctor at Hospital Pusrawi is NOT in a position to decisively state whether Saiful had been sodomised or not.

And all the more in a hospital like Pusrawi that has NO forensic pathology support.

And to be fair to Hospital Pusrawi, I DISAGREE with those who say that from the medical report, it is clear that sodomy did not happen.

Nevertheless, I think the VALUE of this leaked medical report lies in these two points:

  1. Should this report prove to be authentic, we can say one thing for sure:
    There was NO gross injury on Saiful's private parts at that time he was presented for medical examination.
    If there were gross injuries like redness, swelling, bleeding, abrasions, bruises, etc, ANY doctor regardless of whether he is a specialist or not, would be able to recognise it.

    But having said that, NO gross injuries does NOT mean sodomy had NOT happened before.

  2. More importantly, should this report prove to be true and because this was Saiful's FIRST medical visit before he was referred to a government hospital, this would PREVENT anyone from coming out with a fabricated medical report saying that there was gross injuries on Saiful's body.

    And that is where the greatest value of this report lies - NOT in disproving sodomy, but in preventing any further fabrication.
    -"Sepet Guy"


    From "The Aisehman Blog": Read here for more

    It seems that some people (and here) are raising the possibility that Anwar and the Pusrawi doctor are in cahoots, solely based on the fact that they were part of the same organisation, Regional Islamic Da’wah Council of Southeast Asia and the Pacific (RISEAP), years ago.

    Lost in all this speculation is the amazing coincidence that Saiful, ON HIS OWN, went to a hospital where on duty that day was this particular doctor.

    Nobody told Saiful to go to that particular hospital to see that particular doctor on that particular day. By his pet uncle’s (or is it Uncle Pet) own admission, he went there on his own.

    And if Saiful knew beforehand that the doctor was Anwar’s man and was on duty that day at Pusrawi, but yet still went ahead to see him, I can now see why and how Saiful flunked university.

    Some have sought to also link Saiful to the doctor, arguing that the doctor once worked at Universiti Malaya and Saiful the ex-university student might have made his acquaintance.

    Lost in all this is the fact that Saiful attended Universiti Tenaga, not Universiti Malaya. And Saiful did not study medicine. In fact, he didn’t study much.

    They even go further to speculate that Saiful might have a connection with RISEAP, the organisation that the doctor and Anwar was part of.

    Again, lost in all this is the fact, presented by the speculator himself, that the doctor worked there between 1993 and 1995, when Saiful was between eight and ten years old.

    And I like the way the speculator ends his speculation with the cry, “Hidup Malaysiaku!”

    That “shout” — another variant is “Hidup Malaysia!” — tells everyone who knows about these things who the writer is associated with.

    Most former political detainees can tell you where and from whom they’ve heard it before.

    Read here and here and here and here

    • A qualified doctor with 15 years or more years experience has, after a careful and reasonably thorough examination, given an MR that there were no signs of rape, tear, penetration, bleeding etc.
      If you go to any hospital complaining of chest pains they are not going to immediately prescribe an angiogram of bypass operation. They will monitor the condition of the patient and the vital organs, symptons and statistics - sweating, numbness, degree of pain, breathing difficulties, heart-beat rate etc - and only call in the Consultant Cardiac guy when it is reasonably certain the patient is having a degree of cardiac arrest. Not sledgehammer to fly response.

      In this case, Dr.Osman saw no outward signs of sodomy or rape and did the decent and honest thing by advising Saiful that he could get a second opinion to satisfy himself. Does that sound or look like the behaviour of a Conspirator or someone with ulterior motives?
    • Most Accident and Emergency Units (or Emergency Rooms) are staffed by non-specialist medical officers, who are qualified doctors with a valid practicing certificate from MMC (Medical Council of Malaysia).
      When you see a doctor with a complaint (whatever it is), he takes the relevant history, and does the relevant physical examination. He then makes a provisional diagnosis and may proceed with further relevant investigations (blood, urine, xrays etc ..) to confirm or rule out his provisional diagnosis depending on the strength of the history and physical examination. All these is recorded handwritten in his ‘notes’ in the hospital’s stationary, sometimes in full, often in shorthand.

      The doctor in question seems to have done all these. He does not need to be a specialist to evaluate the given complaint. And what’s the difference between ’sodomy’ and a ‘plastic inserted into the anus’?
    • Medical-legal cases are complicated, especially in cases of alleged sexual assault. In first world countries, sexual assault cases would be examine by senior doctor with a lot of postgraduate training in the field.This doctor did one thing right, which is referring the alleged victim to a hospital with more expertise and resources TRO (to rule out) assault. The doctor made the right conclusion, ie he want to rule out assault.

    • One point being missed is WHEN this medical report or note (or whatever it can be called) was written, there was NO way Dr.Osman could have known that this issue would be in the headlines of the nation for the next month.

    • Whether the doctor knew Anwar or not also does not change anything.
      The patient is reported to have said he was sodmised by a VVIP. He is also reported as having said that a plastic object was inserted to his backside. Legally this would be indecent assault, NOT sodomy.

      The doctor may not have known that this is different legally, and since the patient said he was sodomised, he advised him to go to GH to rule out sodomy.

      The point is the doctor could not possibly have had any reason at that time to write anything false, unless he is extremely brilliant and the word sodomy immediately made him think of 1998 and Anwar and thought HAHA!!

    • Unfortunately, in the Court of law, as you are well versed in, this piece of paper is as good a toilet paper unless the maker of the document stands in the witness box and testify as to its contents. Unfair as it may sound, the police fully understands this and is bending (or rather breaking) the law to ensure the this remains a piece of paper. Then again, what’s it about the best evidence rule when the person cannot be traced? The Document is still as good as the paper its worth.

    • Look at Pusrawi’s statement closely and we can conclude that an ANAL examination was indeed conducted. Call it “not sodomy related”. So what? That part of the anatomy was checked and there was no sign of penetration e.g swelling, bleeding or reddish coloration in the area. A casual examination would have revealed that to the experienced doctor.Is the hospital trying to wriggle out of the controversy, now that the Health Ministry has threatened to take actions against it for leaking the report? Why did the police question Dr Osman then?

    • Rocky (Ahirudin Attan), Stop posting nonsense & rubbish article like this!So what if Dr Osman know Anwar? Is that meant he know him then he will do whatever which is against the law? Anwar also know Musa Hassan, so what he had did to Anwar?! Please use your brain to think and analyse before posting rubbish!

    • Rocky (Ahirudin Attan), Your facts are WRONG. Anwar was never in RISEAP. There were many Burmese Muslims in PERKIM AND RISEAP since Tunku was the President of both organisations until he died. After that Patinggi Taib Mahmud took over RISEAP and PERKIM. Now RISEAP is under Pusat Islam Administration.Mahathir is the President of PERKIM. So get your facts right. Anwar was never in RISEAP

    • Rocky (Ahirudin Attan), Why do I get the feeling that you are very pro-Mahathir and all your posts are geared towards discrediting Anwar and the Pakatan Rakyat? Albeit in a subtle tone?

    • Rocky (Ahirudin Attan), I am disgusted at your insuniation that Anwar is up to no good as well. DSAI would not be so stupid to only produce only such a report. Like you said you are sicked of all this, so please do not add one more speculation.

    • I am suprised how cheap this blogger ("Rocky Bru") shows off that he is anti-Anwar. When there are so much dubious things on the part of the police investigating and government ministers giving statements about this case etc. To start with, how is that you never ask why the police did not give the police report to Anwar? Why is the police so hot about the 'liwat' case more than the murder case? What about other issues like SD1 and SD2 and Bala? The whole system of UMNO/BN stinks...I hope you use your God-given brain to good use and don't be a goon following the UMNOputras blindly!

    • I thought Rocky (Ahirudin Attan), doesn't want to be part of this or fed up about all this after he went on STRIKE...hmm

    • I think the Pusrawi GM is quite right. One look at Saiful’s anus, the good doctor concluded that no further examination is necessary. Since Saiful still insist that he was sodomised and planning to lodge a police report then the doctor just advise him to go to the nearby HKL. I think the doctor just don’t want to get himself involve and file the report. If the police requested a report then the hospital will give a proper one. Maybe they did but not the one based on the doctor true opinion.I was told any medical report made by a doctor registered with MMA is a valid document for court purposes. Doesn’t matter if he is not a specialist.

    • Only a specialist can diagnose sodomy? I guess it must be a proctologist. Usually, a proctologist is consulted when a patient needs surgery, or has a complex proctological condition with requires the attention of a professional. Basic problems like small hemorrhoids and mild constipation may be treated by a general practitioner. However, when it becomes apparent that more investigation of a problem is needed, or a patient requires specialized surgery, a general practitioner will refer the patient to a proctologist for high quality care.

    • The tenets of medical diagnosis are good history taking and thorough physical examination. When that’s done well, more often than not, a doctor would not go wrong. Based on the case note, Dr Mohamad Osman had done the needful outstandingly. His medical notes tell us almost all that we need to know. You do not need a specialist to conduct an appropriate physical examination. A rape/sodomy victim in the middle of the night in Gua Musang will probably be examined by the Medical Officer on-call.

    • Fearing actions by the Health Ministry, Pusrawi is now trying to wriggle out of this controversy by denying a sodomy related examination was conducted on Saiful.
      A casual look at the anus could have convinced the doctor that Saiful was lying since there was no swelling, enlargement or reddish coloration. He did not see the need to “go deeper.” My second point. After being confirmed by Dr Osman that Saiful had not been molested, could he have ‘injured’ himself and then gone to KLGH for a second opinion - a more favorable one. Mind you, he lodged the police report 4 hours after going to Pusrawi.

    • I would like to write the following statements in the name of GOD whom I believe. I am a goverment doctor in the rank of consultant working in hospital Kuala Lumpur. I know personally the doctors who examined Saiful on that day -28 June 2008.
      The so called medical report mentioned in the NST is a fabrication or imagination by the UMNO paper. There is NO such medical report submitted to the police yet.

      When examine Saiful, the specialist could not find any signs of Saiful being sodomised. Saiful was very cheerful, unlike real sodomised patient who will usaually very sad and disturbed.Saiful was subsequently admitted to the ward and observed for a day.He was completely well in the ward and not emotionally disturbed.
    • Saiful is reportedly to have lodge a police report that he was last sodomised on 26th June, i.e. 2 days before he went to see doctor and lodge the police report. Now it is reportedly certified by a doctor 4 hours before he reportedly lodge the police report. If he was sodomised during these 4 hours, it was not reported in his reported police report. I am now confused.

    • Another look at this ‘evidence’ , if you can consider it as evidence at all, the way I see, it actually does not tell you anything. It simply conclude that it cannot conclude. It did not say that anal penetration did occur, it simply says that it cannot find evidence of occurrence. It could still have happen. One could have use lubricant before submission (or whatever you call it). It can be argued this way. Am i right or not? Is this good enough for the court of public opinion, perhaps. It may not be so on the other side.

    • Don’t get too excited…The report was preliminary and not conclusive, and that’s the reason why he was referred to HKL specialists where detailed investigations were done.

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